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FRIENDS OF RACING HEAKD TWO CABINET MINISTERS SPEAK FOE SPORT AT CANADIAN HEARING Strong Arguments Adduced at Ottawa in Opposition to the Miller Bill Light on Financial FinancialAspects Aspects of Sport Ottawa Out January 21 That the raisins of thoroughbreds is largely tlejiendcHt upon tests of speed at race meetings and that race meetings cau iint be successfully carried on if the betting element is clliniuateil was again the contention urged before the Commons special committee to which was re ¬ ferred the Miller hill for the suppression of Itetting Two prominent cabinet ministers the masters of th Montreal and Ottawa Hunts and other prominent Canadians were placed on the witness stand by the opponents of the bill At the morning sitting Dr McEachren a prominent veterinary surgeon and horse breeder of Montreal Dr Webster master of the Ottawa Hunt Club A E Ogilvie president of Ihe Montreal Hunt Club and Hon J S Heudrie of Hamilton all testilied thsir they considered racing with its concomitant of batting at race tracks neces ¬ sary to the breeding and development of thorough ¬ breds Dr McEachren as a horse breeder of many years experience declared that horse racing had done much to improve the breed of horses and the hill If passed would be a serious menace to the in ¬ dustry and would tend to do away with jockey clubs He considered that any betting which took place in connection with horse racing should be confined to the course and subject to the control of the associa ¬ tion tionDr Dr Webster who concurred in this opinion saw 110 harm in the business of the professional bookmaker so Jong as he did business on the square In Eng ¬ land horse racing was carried on in some parts of the country continuously from the third week In March till the third week in November the meetings iKing under control of the English Jockey Club Dr Webster thought there should be only one charter Iu one city He would have no meet longer than fourteen days He would suppress betting in pool ¬ rooms and everywhere except on the race track He would limit the dividend paid on jockey club stock to 10 per cent the balance of all earnings to go to make up purses for the benefit of breeders breedersI I would stop the merrygoround It gets bad toward the last he said ln other words you would abolish such things as ninetyday meetings in British Columbia and you would take racing out of the hands of professional gamblersV summed up Mr McCarthy McCarthyYes Mr YesMr Yes Uaney asked if the present law was satisfac ¬ tory to the racing associations Witness said ho thought it was far from perfect He would make bookmaking legal but would control it itA A E Ogilvie nephew of the late Senator Ogilvie and master of the Montreal Hunt said that if racing were abandoned he would give tip breeding He is now interested in it to quite si considerable extent extentCan Can you see any difference between betting with a friend or betting with a IwokmakcrV Which would vou prefer he was asked 1 think I would prefer betting with the book ¬ maker Why WhyBecause Because well because I think it more of a busi ¬ ness arrangement Well then too you would be likely to bet more prudently with a bookmaker than a friend V VYes Yes because I would have the cash in my hand With a friend I might make a verbal bet for more money than 1 timid afford affordMr Mr Uaney Do you regard Jietting as an evil evilNo No NoDo Do you liellevc the professional bookmaker is an aneviir eviir eviirXo Xo Mr XoMr Ogilvie thought the length of any race meet ¬ ing might be limited to fourteen days hut he thought it undesirable to liniiu it to any shorter period Without the stimulus financial and otherwise offered by race meetings owners would not continue UK breeding of horses said Hon Colonel Hendri If this bill is passed it wilt kill horse racing Then is a natural instinct in most men to bet It has gone on since the world began and it will go on to the end The financial results of his own expe ¬ rience In the breeding of race horses lie explained hail not been encouraging It must have cost his father 300000 or 400000 He himself had partial lv paid expenses but his horses were still indebted t him to the extent of 20000 20000That That means vou have lost monev onit onitVes Ves but I do not grudge it 1 do it for the love of thi horse horseAnswering Answering Mr Black M I Colonel Heudrie said IIK thought the period of race mietlngs might be lim jtid to thirteen days daysHe He said that from a conversation with his own father regarding Sir John Maedonilds betting legis ¬ lation he hail learned that the legislation was really intended to legalize lietting in certain parts of the race course during the progress of a meeting meetingHave Have yon any shares in the Ontario Jockey Club ClubI I have one share It pays me 10 a year yearHow How about the large assets of the Ontario Jockey Club ClubWell Well owing to the danger of prosecution or per ¬ secution 1 dont know which it really is the club has been laying up Its surplus However if we were sure of being allowed to continue this money would be invested ill grandstands and other things What is your chilis surplus asked Mr Uaney I think there is altfmt lliAlO Invested In stocks and alMiut 10 MHH of that is a mortgage on the property so we have a surplus of about 0 X ash Of course I imagine our assets exceed our liabilities by alxmt 300000 However these figures are only approximate What do you think of the present law lawWell Well I think it is not a good thing to have the bookies as free lances in the hotting ring I think thev should he in a cirtain place so that they are always easy to find and regulate regulatelio lio you recognize any distinction between the tracks at the Woodbine and Hamilton as against those at Windsor and Fort Erie ErieWell Well I think Canadians as a whole are more citortloving people than the Americans and they Vn1 mostly Americans who attend the two tracks iienr the border borderHon Hon Adam Beck gave it as his opinion that an infusion of thoroughbred blood is essential for the riixing of X 1 horses and that thoroughbreds could not be tested except by racing racingThe The infusion of thoroughbred blood he suld ives to the horse courage stamina and endurance vvcent for thi stimulus given by racing thorough ¬ breds would not lie bred At the time of the South African war Mr Beck said it was a notable fact that there were more remounts purchased in the London listrict than all the rest of Canada This he at rttinted to the use of thoroughbred stock the in tniductlon of which in the locality probably dated Continued on second page TRIENDS OF RACING HEARD back to the time when the English officers came over with their chargers Would vou approve of a law which makes race ¬ track betting unlawful asked Mr Raney who is in charge of the bill billMr Mr Beck replied that betting on the race track was the smallest feature of betting on horses in Canada He believed there was as much betting going on in the winter in Canada when there were uo race meetings being held in the dominion as there was at any other time I believe said Mr Beck that the average decent man that goes to the race track and bets does it for the interest he takes in the race whereas the man who does it all through the winter does it iu a professional sense Mr iteck said he thought it an impossibility to eliminate gambling If people did not bet on horse races they would find other me ¬ diums for betting bettingE E W Cook ot Morrisburg gave evidence confirm atory of that given by previous witnesses If there were no race meetings 1 would sell my horses unques ¬ tionably he said V V Henderson of Lachine followed along similar lines linesHugh Hugh Patton president of the Shcddon Company which with subsidiary companies owns between 1400 and 1509 horses said as a breeder he consid ¬ ered the race course essential to the breeding of thor ¬ oughbreds He agreed with previous witnesses that if the bill passed and iu consequence rediiccd the in ¬ terest in and the attendance at race meetings he would have to close down his stables as there would be no encouragement Large purses he considered accessary at race meetings if the thoroughbred stables were to be continued continuedMr Mr Paton in reply to the chairman said he was connected witli several large financial institu ¬ tions Supposing said the chairman you were selecting a man 1or a trustworthy position in one of tiiese institutions Supposing two men applied of whom one bet with the bookmaker and the other did not would that make any difference in your selec ¬ tion Xo it would nut make any difference at all replied the witness witnessBartlett Bartlett McLennan president of the Montreal TransiK rtation Company Montreal said he would like to see the race meetings as short as possible He did not think however the period could be made less daysA than thirteen days A It London secretary of the Hamilton Jockey Club was called by Mr Itaney in regard to the finances of tin Hamilton Jockey Club The total value of the clubs proi erty he said was estimated at from 173 KH to 2XOOO The cash surplus was between 45 MX and 50000 50000What What is tho paidup capital of the clubs asked Mr Haney Forty PIT cent ou ten thousand dol ¬ lars replied Mr Loudon LoudonMr Mr Itaney elicited the fact that the net profit of the Hamilton Jockey Club at the fall meeting last year was 32257 and at the spring meeting 38013 38013That That there would be no profits and that on the contrary there would be smaller purses or a loss unless money was realized from the sale of book making privileges is shown by the following table which is compiled from the sworn returns of the Hamilton Jockey Club for the past three years yearsFrom From Gate receipt Bookmakers Purses 1907 9025 sK29o 57820 578201MIS 1MIS 52155 59000 73030 1909 59405 74800 70850 70850Conmiittccmaii Conmiittccmaii McColl referring to Mr Kancys suggestion that with the removal of bookmakiug people would feel freer to attend the races asked Do you know if the King of England attends races where betting is going on Does th governorgen ¬ eral Do lieutenantgovernors attend Do judges and senators and members of Parliament and clergy ¬ men go goYes YesWell Yes Well then can anybody suggest that there could be any improvement in quality Applause qualityApplause and laughter drowned the reply
